Civic Intelligence

Lutheran Resale Shop

EIN 43-6050771 • 501(c)3 • St Louis, MO

Profile

Support Lutheran Organization

6701 West Florissant AveSt Louis, MO 63136
Siviq Scores

Precomputed percentiles relative to similar nonprofits. These scores are descriptive rather than judgmental.

Liabilities / Assets

59th percentile

0.00x

Tied with the lowest-debt nonprofits in its peer group.

501(c)3 • <$500k nonprofits • Source year 2025

Liabilities / Revenue

61st percentile

0.00x

Tied with the lowest-debt nonprofits in its peer group.

501(c)3 • <$500k nonprofits • Source year 2025

Net Margin

70th percentile

15%

Higher net margin than 70% of similar nonprofits.

501(c)3 • <$500k nonprofits • Source year 2025

Top Officer Pay

84th percentile

$0

Higher top officer pay than 84% of similar nonprofits.

Top officer pay equals 0.0% of source-year revenue.

501(c)3 • <$500k nonprofits • Source year 2025

Asset Growth

93rd percentile

108%

Faster asset growth than 93% of similar nonprofits.

501(c)3 • <$500k nonprofits • Annualized from 2024 to 2025

Revenue Growth

81st percentile

37%

Faster revenue growth than 81% of similar nonprofits.

501(c)3 • <$500k nonprofits • Annualized from 2024 to 2025

Balance Sheet
Liabilities / Assets59th percentile

Assets

Up

$19,443

Up $10,101 (+108%) from 2024

Liabilities

Flat

$0

Flat from 2024

Net Assets

Up

$19,443

Up $10,101 (+108%) from 2024

Operations
Liabilities / Revenue61st percentileNet Margin70th percentile

Revenue

Up

$65,253

Up $17,587 (+37%) from 2024

Expenses

Down

$55,152

Down $170 (-0.3%) from 2024

Net Income

Up

$10,101

Up $17,757 (+232%) from 2024

Trend Graphs

Balance Sheet Trend

Asset Growth93rd percentile

Grouped bars show assets, liabilities, and net assets across loaded filings.

$40K$30K$20K$10K$0Assets 2011: $13,204Liabilities 2011: $02011Assets 2012: $19,459Liabilities 2012: $02012Assets 2013: $13,764Liabilities 2013: $02013Assets 2014: $19,715Liabilities 2014: $02014Assets 2015: $21,858Liabilities 2015: $02015Assets 2016: $30,390Liabilities 2016: $02016Assets 2017: $16,576Liabilities 2017: $02017Assets 2018: $15,857Liabilities 2018: $02018Assets 2019: $18,072Liabilities 2019: $02019Assets 2020: $20,868Liabilities 2020: $02020Assets 2021: $27,113Liabilities 2021: $0Net Assets 2021: $27,1132021Assets 2022: $21,073Liabilities 2022: $0Net Assets 2022: $21,0732022Assets 2023: $16,998Liabilities 2023: $0Net Assets 2023: $16,9982023Assets 2024: $9,342Liabilities 2024: $0Net Assets 2024: $9,3422024Assets 2025: $19,443Liabilities 2025: $0Net Assets 2025: $19,4432025

Highlighted filing

2025

Assets$19,443
Liabilities$0
Net Assets$19,443
Open 2025 Filing

Operations Trend

Revenue Growth81st percentile

Revenue, expenses, and net income by year, with the latest filing highlighted.

$80K$60K$40K$20K$0-$20KRevenue 2011: $29,186Expenses 2011: $22,943Net Income 2011: $6,2432011Revenue 2012: $39,377Expenses 2012: $33,122Net Income 2012: $6,2552012Revenue 2013: $42,766Expenses 2013: $48,462Net Income 2013: -$5,6962013Revenue 2014: $45,923Expenses 2014: $40,642Net Income 2014: $5,2812014Revenue 2015: $43,740Expenses 2015: $41,597Net Income 2015: $2,1432015Revenue 2016: $61,670Expenses 2016: $53,298Net Income 2016: $8,3722016Revenue 2017: $46,026Expenses 2017: $58,215Net Income 2017: -$12,1892017Revenue 2018: $42,750Expenses 2018: $43,303Net Income 2018: -$5532018Revenue 2019: $39,887Expenses 2019: $37,572Net Income 2019: $2,3152019Revenue 2020: $35,713Expenses 2020: $32,918Net Income 2020: $2,7952020Revenue 2021: $57,316Expenses 2021: $51,071Net Income 2021: $6,2452021Revenue 2022: $46,262Expenses 2022: $52,302Net Income 2022: -$6,0402022Revenue 2023: $44,021Expenses 2023: $48,096Net Income 2023: -$4,0752023Revenue 2024: $47,666Expenses 2024: $55,322Net Income 2024: -$7,6562024Revenue 2025: $65,253Expenses 2025: $55,152Net Income 2025: $10,1012025

Highlighted filing

2025

Revenue$65,253
Expenses$55,152
Net Income$10,101
Open 2025 Filing

Filings

Most recent year

2025 • Form 990EZDetailed filing. Detailed filing data is available for this year.

Open filing
Assets
$19,443
Liabilities
$0
Net assets
$19,443
Revenue
$65,253
Expenses
$55,152
Net income
$10,101
Balance SheetOperations
YearAssetsLiabilitiesNet AssetsRevenueExpensesNet Income
2025Detailed filing. Detailed filing data is available for this year.$19.4$0.00$19.4$65.3$55.2$10.1
2024Detailed filing. Detailed filing data is available for this year.$9.34$0.00$9.34$47.7$55.3$7.66
2023Detailed filing. Detailed filing data is available for this year.$17.0$0.00$17.0$44.0$48.1$4.08
2022Detailed filing. Detailed filing data is available for this year.$21.1$0.00$21.1$46.3$52.3$6.04
2021Detailed filing. Detailed filing data is available for this year.$27.1$0.00$27.1$57.3$51.1$6.25
2020Summary only. Only limited summary data is available for this year.$20.9$0.00$35.7$32.9$2.80
2019Summary only. Only limited summary data is available for this year.$18.1$0.00$39.9$37.6$2.32
2018Summary only. Only limited summary data is available for this year.$15.9$0.00$42.8$43.3$0.55
2017Summary only. Only limited summary data is available for this year.$16.6$0.00$46.0$58.2$12.2
2016Summary only. Only limited summary data is available for this year.$30.4$0.00$61.7$53.3$8.37
2015Summary only. Only limited summary data is available for this year.$21.9$0.00$43.7$41.6$2.14
2014Summary only. Only limited summary data is available for this year.$19.7$0.00$45.9$40.6$5.28
2013Summary only. Only limited summary data is available for this year.$13.8$0.00$42.8$48.5$5.70
2012Summary only. Only limited summary data is available for this year.$19.5$0.00$39.4$33.1$6.26
2011Summary only. Only limited summary data is available for this year.$13.2$0.00$29.2$22.9$6.24
Latest Filing Detail
Jump To
Filing Snapshot
Filing Period
Oct 1, 2024 to Sep 30, 2025
Signed
Nov 5, 2025
Return Version
2024v5.0
Gross Receipts
$65,253
Mission and Program Overview

Mission

Support Lutheran Organization

Program Services

DescriptionGrantsExpenses
Lutheran Family and Children's Services, 9666 Olive Blvd #400, St Louis, MO 63122$15,000$0
Lutheran Senior Services, 1450 Hanley Industrial Ct, St Louis, MO 63144$7,500$0
Evertrue, 1450 Hanley Industrial Ct, St Louis, MO 63144$7,500$0
Compensation and Service Providers
Top Officer Pay84th percentile

Employees

NameTitleFull / Part TimeBaseOtherTotal
Marlene HeislenPresident-$0--
Lexine PranschkeSecretary-$0--
Judith JacksonTreasurer-$0--
Filing and Contact Details

Filer

Filer Name
Lutheran Resale Shop
EIN
43-6050771
Phone
3143899970
Address
6701 West Florissant Ave, St Louis, MO 63136

Signing Officer

Name
Judith Jackson
Title
Treasurer
Phone
3148317333
Signed
2025-11-05
Supplemental Narrative

Additional Explanations

Form 990-EZ, Part I, Line 10

“300Donations to Lutheran Family and Children's Serves, 9666 Olive Bldv #300, St. Louis, MO 63122; Donation to Lutheran Senior Services, 1150 Hanley Industrial Ct, St. Louis, MO 63144; Donation to Evertrue, 1150 Hanley Industrial Ct, St. Louis, MO 63144”

Form 990-EZ, Part I, Line 16

“Property tax, license, fire ext srv, gas reimbusement”

Raw XML Appendix184 raw XML fields

This appendix keeps the raw XML leaves available for debugging and edge-case review. The human report above is the primary experience.

Path#Value
IRS990EZ/ActivitiesNotPreviouslyRptInd00
IRS990EZ/BenefitsPaidToOrForMembersAmt00
IRS990EZ/BooksInCareOfDetail/PersonNm0Judith Jackson
IRS990EZ/BooksInCareOfDetail/PhoneNum03148317333
IRS990EZ/BooksInCareOfDetail/USAddress/AddressLine1Txt0600 Fox Plains Dr
IRS990EZ/BooksInCareOfDetail/USAddress/CityNm0Florissant
IRS990EZ/BooksInCareOfDetail/USAddress/StateAbbreviationCd0MO
IRS990EZ/BooksInCareOfDetail/USAddress/ZIPCd063034
IRS990EZ/CashSavingsAndInvestmentsGrp/BOYAmt09342
IRS990EZ/CashSavingsAndInvestmentsGrp/EOYAmt019443
IRS990EZ/ChgMadeToOrgnzngDocNotRptInd00
IRS990EZ/ContributionsGiftsGrantsEtcAmt065253
IRS990EZ/CostOfGoodsSoldAmt00
IRS990EZ/CostOrOtherBasisExpenseSaleAmt00
IRS990EZ/DirectIndirectPltclExpendAmt00
IRS990EZ/DonorAdvisedFndsInd00
IRS990EZ/EngagedInExcessBenefitTransInd00
IRS990EZ/ExcessOrDeficitForYearAmt010101
IRS990EZ/FeesAndOtherPymtToIndCntrctAmt00
IRS990EZ/FiledScheduleAInd01
IRS990EZ/ForeignFinancialAccountInd00
IRS990EZ/ForeignOfficeInd00
IRS990EZ/Form1120PolFiledInd00
IRS990EZ/Form990TotalAssetsGrp/BOYAmt09342
IRS990EZ/Form990TotalAssetsGrp/EOYAmt019443
IRS990EZ/FundraisingGrossIncomeAmt00
IRS990EZ/GainOrLossFromSaleOfAssetsAmt00
IRS990EZ/GamingGrossIncomeAmt00
IRS990EZ/GrantsAndSimilarAmountsPaidAmt030000
IRS990EZ/GrossProfitLossSlsOfInvntryAmt00
IRS990EZ/GrossReceiptsAmt065253
IRS990EZ/GrossSalesOfInventoryAmt00
IRS990EZ/InfoInScheduleOPartIInd0X
IRS990EZ/InvestmentIncomeAmt00
IRS990EZ/LandAndBuildingsGrp/BOYAmt00
IRS990EZ/LandAndBuildingsGrp/EOYAmt00
IRS990EZ/LobbyingActivitiesInd00
IRS990EZ/MadeLoansToFromOfficersInd00
IRS990EZ/MembershipDuesAmt00
IRS990EZ/MethodOfAccountingCashInd0X
IRS990EZ/NetAssetsOrFundBalancesBOYAmt09342
IRS990EZ/NetAssetsOrFundBalancesEOYAmt019443
IRS990EZ/NetAssetsOrFundBalancesGrp/BOYAmt09342
IRS990EZ/NetAssetsOrFundBalancesGrp/EOYAmt019443
IRS990EZ/OccupancyRentUtltsAndMaintAmt023864
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/AverageHrsPerWkDevotedToPosRt00
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/AverageHrsPerWkDevotedToPosRt10
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/AverageHrsPerWkDevotedToPosRt20
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/CompensationAmt00
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/CompensationAmt10
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/CompensationAmt20
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/EmployeeBenefitProgramAmt00
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/EmployeeBenefitProgramAmt10
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/EmployeeBenefitProgramAmt20
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/ExpenseAccountOtherAllwncAmt00
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/ExpenseAccountOtherAllwncAmt10
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/ExpenseAccountOtherAllwncAmt20
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/PersonNm0Marlene Heislen
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/PersonNm1Lexine Pranschke
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/PersonNm2Judith Jackson
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/TitleTxt0President
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/TitleTxt1Secretary
IRS990EZ/OfficerDirectorTrusteeEmplGrp/TitleTxt2Treasurer
IRS990EZ/OperateHospitalInd00
IRS990EZ/Organization501c3Ind0X
IRS990EZ/OrganizationDissolvedEtcInd00
IRS990EZ/OrganizationHadUBIInd00
IRS990EZ/OtherAssetsTotalDetail/BOYAmt00
IRS990EZ/OtherAssetsTotalDetail/EOYAmt00
IRS990EZ/OtherChangesInNetAssetsAmt00
IRS990EZ/OtherExpensesTotalAmt01288
IRS990EZ/OtherRevenueTotalAmt00
IRS990EZ/PartVIHghstPdCntrctProfSrvcTxt0NONE
IRS990EZ/PartVIOfCompOfHghstPdEmplTxt0NONE
IRS990EZ/PoliticalCampaignActyInd00
IRS990EZ/PrimaryExemptPurposeTxt0Support Lutheran Organization
IRS990EZ/PrintingPublicationsPostageAmt00
IRS990EZ/ProgramServiceRevenueAmt00
IRS990EZ/ProgramSrvcAccomplishmentGrp/DescriptionProgramSrvcAccomTxt0Lutheran Family and Children's Services, 9666 Olive Blvd #400, St Louis, MO 63122
IRS990EZ/ProgramSrvcAccomplishmentGrp/DescriptionProgramSrvcAccomTxt1Lutheran Senior Services, 1450 Hanley Industrial Ct, St Louis, MO 63144
IRS990EZ/ProgramSrvcAccomplishmentGrp/DescriptionProgramSrvcAccomTxt2Evertrue, 1450 Hanley Industrial Ct, St Louis, MO 63144
IRS990EZ/ProgramSrvcAccomplishmentGrp/GrantsAndAllocationsAmt015000
IRS990EZ/ProgramSrvcAccomplishmentGrp/GrantsAndAllocationsAmt17500
IRS990EZ/ProgramSrvcAccomplishmentGrp/GrantsAndAllocationsAmt27500
IRS990EZ/ProgramSrvcAccomplishmentGrp/ProgramServiceExpensesAmt00
IRS990EZ/ProgramSrvcAccomplishmentGrp/ProgramServiceExpensesAmt10
IRS990EZ/ProgramSrvcAccomplishmentGrp/ProgramServiceExpensesAmt20
IRS990EZ/ProhibitedTaxShelterTransInd00
IRS990EZ/RelatedOrganizationCtrlEntInd00
IRS990EZ/SalariesOtherCompEmplBnftAmt00
IRS990EZ/SaleOfAssetsGrossAmt00
IRS990EZ/ScheduleBNotRequiredInd0X
IRS990EZ/SchoolOperatingInd00
IRS990EZ/SpecialEventsDirectExpensesAmt00
IRS990EZ/SpecialEventsNetIncomeLossAmt00
IRS990EZ/StatesWhereCopyOfReturnIsFldCd0MO
IRS990EZ/SubjectToProxyTaxInd00
IRS990EZ/SumOfTotalLiabilitiesGrp/BOYAmt00
IRS990EZ/SumOfTotalLiabilitiesGrp/EOYAmt00
IRS990EZ/TanningServicesProvidedInd00
IRS990EZ/TaxImposedOnOrganizationMgrAmt00
IRS990EZ/TaxImposedUnderIRC4911Amt00
IRS990EZ/TaxImposedUnderIRC4912Amt00
IRS990EZ/TaxImposedUnderIRC4955Amt00
IRS990EZ/TaxReimbursedByOrganizationAmt00
IRS990EZ/TotalExpensesAmt055152
IRS990EZ/TotalProgramServiceExpensesAmt00
IRS990EZ/TotalRevenueAmt065253
IRS990EZ/TransactionWithControlEntInd00
IRS990EZ/TrnsfrExmptNonChrtblRltdOrgInd00
IRS990EZ/TypeOfOrganizationCorpInd0X
IRS990ScheduleA/GiftsGrantsContriRcvd170Grp/CurrentTaxYearAmt050253
IRS990ScheduleA/GiftsGrantsContriRcvd170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus1YearAmt047666
IRS990ScheduleA/GiftsGrantsContriRcvd170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus2YearsAmt044021
IRS990ScheduleA/GiftsGrantsContriRcvd170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus3YearsAmt046262
IRS990ScheduleA/GiftsGrantsContriRcvd170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus4YearsAmt057316
IRS990ScheduleA/GiftsGrantsContriRcvd170Grp/TotalAmt0245518
IRS990ScheduleA/GovtFurnSrvcFcltsVl170Grp/CurrentTaxYearAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/GovtFurnSrvcFcltsVl170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus1YearAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/GovtFurnSrvcFcltsVl170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus2YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/GovtFurnSrvcFcltsVl170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus3YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/GovtFurnSrvcFcltsVl170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus4YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/GovtFurnSrvcFcltsVl170Grp/TotalAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/GrossInvestmentIncome170Grp/CurrentTaxYearAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/GrossInvestmentIncome170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus1YearAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/GrossInvestmentIncome170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus2YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/GrossInvestmentIncome170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus3YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/GrossInvestmentIncome170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus4YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/GrossInvestmentIncome170Grp/TotalAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/GrossReceiptsRltdActivitiesAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/OtherIncome170Grp/CurrentTaxYearAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/OtherIncome170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus1YearAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/OtherIncome170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus2YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/OtherIncome170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus3YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/OtherIncome170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus4YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/OtherIncome170Grp/TotalAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/PublicOrganization170Ind0X
IRS990ScheduleA/PublicSupportCY170Pct01
IRS990ScheduleA/PublicSupportPY170Pct01
IRS990ScheduleA/PublicSupportTotal170Amt0245518
IRS990ScheduleA/SubstantialContributorsTotAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/TaxRevLeviedOrgnztnlBnft170Grp/CurrentTaxYearAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/TaxRevLeviedOrgnztnlBnft170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus1YearAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/TaxRevLeviedOrgnztnlBnft170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus2YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/TaxRevLeviedOrgnztnlBnft170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus3YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/TaxRevLeviedOrgnztnlBnft170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus4YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/TaxRevLeviedOrgnztnlBnft170Grp/TotalAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/ThirtyThrPctSuprtTestsPY170Ind0X
IRS990ScheduleA/TotalCalendarYear170Grp/CurrentTaxYearAmt050253
IRS990ScheduleA/TotalCalendarYear170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus1YearAmt047666
IRS990ScheduleA/TotalCalendarYear170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus2YearsAmt044021
IRS990ScheduleA/TotalCalendarYear170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus3YearsAmt046262
IRS990ScheduleA/TotalCalendarYear170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus4YearsAmt057316
IRS990ScheduleA/TotalCalendarYear170Grp/TotalAmt0245518
IRS990ScheduleA/TotalSupportAmt0245518
IRS990ScheduleA/UnrelatedBusinessNetIncm170Grp/CurrentTaxYearAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/UnrelatedBusinessNetIncm170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus1YearAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/UnrelatedBusinessNetIncm170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus2YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/UnrelatedBusinessNetIncm170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus3YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/UnrelatedBusinessNetIncm170Grp/CurrentTaxYearMinus4YearsAmt00
IRS990ScheduleA/UnrelatedBusinessNetIncm170Grp/TotalAmt00
IRS990ScheduleO/SupplementalInformationDetail/ExplanationTxt0300Donations to Lutheran Family and Children's Serves, 9666 Olive Bldv #300, St. Louis, MO 63122; Donation to Lutheran Senior Services, 1150 Hanley Industrial Ct, St. Louis, MO 63144; Donation to Evertrue, 1150 Hanley Industrial Ct, St. Louis, MO 63144
IRS990ScheduleO/SupplementalInformationDetail/ExplanationTxt1Property tax, license, fire ext srv, gas reimbusement
IRS990ScheduleO/SupplementalInformationDetail/FormAndLineReferenceDesc0Form 990-EZ, Part I, Line 10
IRS990ScheduleO/SupplementalInformationDetail/FormAndLineReferenceDesc1Form 990-EZ, Part I, Line 16
ReturnHeader/BuildTS02025-03-06 01:10:19Z
ReturnHeader/BusinessOfficerGrp/PersonNm0Judith Jackson
ReturnHeader/BusinessOfficerGrp/PersonTitleTxt0Treasurer
ReturnHeader/BusinessOfficerGrp/PhoneNum03148317333
ReturnHeader/BusinessOfficerGrp/SignatureDt02025-11-05
ReturnHeader/Filer/BusinessName/BusinessNameLine1Txt0LUTHERAN RESALE SHOP
ReturnHeader/Filer/BusinessNameControlTxt0LUTH
ReturnHeader/Filer/EIN0436050771
ReturnHeader/Filer/PhoneNum03143899970
ReturnHeader/Filer/USAddress/AddressLine1Txt06701 West Florissant Ave
ReturnHeader/Filer/USAddress/CityNm0St Louis
ReturnHeader/Filer/USAddress/StateAbbreviationCd0MO
ReturnHeader/Filer/USAddress/ZIPCd063136
ReturnHeader/IRSResponsiblePrtyInfoCurrInd01
ReturnHeader/ReturnTs02025-11-05T12:32:01-07:00
ReturnHeader/ReturnTypeCd0990EZ
ReturnHeader/TaxPeriodBeginDt02024-10-01
ReturnHeader/TaxPeriodEndDt02025-09-30
ReturnHeader/TaxYr02024

Document Assets

No mirrored PDF or thumbnail assets are attached yet.